Guys

I have a gearbox problem.
My mates buggy is swing axle but the Gearbox is knackered ?
We can only source a 1600 irs gb locally
is it possible to convert a irs gb to swing axle application?
and how easy is it to convert a IRS gearbox to swing arm application?

thanks

Caloun

You can but its a big job...

Strip both gearbox's old and new. You have to use the original case, because the IRS one only has one side plate, for the swing axle bits to work you need both sides. You will then have to bolt the IRS gear cluster into the original case then, strip down the crown wheel off the IRS diff and put it on the swing axle diff (they are different too) and providing its not the diff that is gone. Lastly rebuild the 'new' gearbox not forgetting to reshim the paddles on the axles... :rolleyes:

....surely someone has a swing axle box in your area :ph43r:

thanks

maybe just weld the rest of the IRS setup on probably easier!

the engine and gearbox are out and the shell does take much to take it off

and have irs rear end :D

there are irs gearboxes with sideplates on both sides !!!

if you can find these one, you only have to change plates/swingarms....

I thought these were the "8:31"

excuse my ignorance what does a side plate look like ?

you mean take the torsion housing to pieces?

what this refer to ?

Caloun

IRS gearbox's with both side plates do exist, they were fitted to type 3 's only (certainly in the UK anyhow) But seeing as you quoted you had a bug one then it had to have only the one...as fitted to 1302 / 1303 beetles

The side plate is the big round disc type casting that fits into the side of the gearbox. If it's a transaxle like the VW is then you need at least one side plate to get the diff in and out. B) The swing 'axle' looks like a canoe paddle out of the gearbox as it has a paddle on the end. This floats in a groove at the diff end and once shimmed is held in place with a big collar and circlip. Take off a axle rubber gator and you will see wot I mean :D

If you have all the stuff to go IRS then go for it but....

IRS is better for the street, and swing axle is tougher off road B)

8:31 is diff ratio.. theres also a 8:33 and 8:35... 8:31 is the "long" ratio for all 1600cc engines and the 33/35 are mostly fitted on 1200, 1300 and 1500 cc..

in holland we have more kinds of gearboxes. even with LSD !!! (limited slip diff) :D

you can find more on www.buggyboys.be

also bit english... but then mine

Code Gebruik Differentiëel Productie SD HA OH Info
AA 1200 (35:8) 4.375 P vanaf Nr 0 981 810
AB 1300 (35:8) 4.375 08/70 P
AC 1500 (33:8) 4.125 08/70 P ook enkele 1300
AD 1200 (35:8) 4.375 X
AE 1300 (35:8) 4.375 X
AF 1500 (33:8) 4.125 X
AG 1200 (35:8) 4.375 Type 147 Fridolin
AH 15/1600 (33:8) 4.125 08/68 08/72 S ook 1302S
AK 15/1600 (31:8) 3.875 Type 181
AL 15/1600 (31:8) 3.875 X Type 181
AM 1300 (35:8) 4.375 08/70 Limo en Cabrio
AN 1600 (31:8) 3.875 08/70 Karmann Ghia ("S")
AO 1600 (31:8) 3.875 08/70 Karmann Ghia ("S")
AP 1300 (35:8) 4.375 08/70 X
AQ 1600 (33:8) 4.125 08/70 08/72 X
AR 1600 (31:8) 3.875 08/70 X Karmann Ghia ("S")
AS 1600 (31:8) 3.875 08/72 Type-1
AT 1600 (31:8) 3.875 08/72 1303S en Cabrio
AU 1600 (31:8) 3.875 08/72 X 1303S en Cabrio
AX 1300 (35:8) 4.375 4de 0,93 (58:54)
BA 13/1500 (35:8) 4.375 08/68 08/70 X
BC 13/1500 (35:8) 4.375 08/68 08/70 X X
BE 1600 (33:8) 4.125 08/70 08/71 X
BF 1600 (33:8) 4.125 08/70 08/71 X X
BG 1300 (33:8) 4.125 08/70 X Karmann Ghia
BH 1300 (33:8) 4.125 08/70 X X Karmann Ghia
BJ 1300 (35:8) 4.375 08/70 X
BK 1300 (35:8) 4.375 08/70 X X
DA 15/1600 (33:8) 4.125 08/68 P Type-3
DB 15/1600 (33:8) 4.125 08/68 X P Type-3
DC 15/1600 (33:8) 4.125 08/68 S Type-3
DD 15/1600 (33:8) 4.125 08/68 X S Type-3

Gebruik = toegepassing bij aangegeven cylinderinhoud
Productie = van en tot datum
SD = SperDifferentiëel
HA = HalfAutomaat half-automatic
OH = Ophanging (P = Pendelachse-->swingarm / S = Schräglenker -->irs)

Transmissie Verhoudingen


Productie 1e 2e 3e 4e
08/66 3.80 2.06 1.32 0.89
08/66 03/70 3.80 2.06 1.26 0.89
03/70 11/72 3.80 2.06 1.26 0.88
11/72 3.78 2.06 1.2 6 0.93


Transmissie Differentiëlen


Gebruik Differentiëel / used diffs
12/1300 (35:8) 4.375
1500 (33:8) 4.125
1600 (1302 S) (33:8) 4.125
1600 (1303 S) (31:8) 3.875

So in summary we need a gearbox fitted to a type three with two side plates .

The next bit I am unclear on do we fit the drive shafts off the IRS gearbox and change the spring plates? or ?

They do have some Buses and other notchbacks which is which re type?
cheers

Caloun

found this on vw emporium

Codes Model Final Drive Notes

AA 1200 4.375 From Chassis No 0 981 810
AB 1300 4.375 Up to 8/70
AC 1500 4.125 also some 1300 from 8/70
AD 1200 4.375 Limited Slip Differential
AE 1300 4.375 Limited Slip Differential
AF 1500 4.125 Limited Slip Differential up to 8/70; also some 1300 from 8/70
AG 1200 4.375 Type 147 Fridolin
AH 1500 4.125 IRS from 8/68
1600 4.125 8/69 – 8/72
AK 1500 3.875 Type 181 up to 8/70
1600 3.875 Type 181 from 8/70
AL 1500 3.875 Type 181 with LSD up to 8/70
1600 3.875 Type 181 with LSD from 8/70
AM 1300 4.375 Saloon and Cabrio from 8/70
AN 1600 3.875 Karmann Ghia with IRS from 8/70
AO 1600 4.125 Karmann Ghia from 8/70
AP 1300 4.375 LSD from 8/70
AQ 1600 4.125 LSD 8/70 – 8/72
AR 1600 3.875 Karmann Ghia with LSD from 8/70
AS 1600cc 3.875 From 3/72
AT 1600 3.875 1303s and Cabrio from 3/72
AU 1600 3.875 1303s and Cabrio from 3/72 with LSD
BA 1300 / 1500 4.375 Semi Automatic from 8/68 – 8/70
BC 1300 / 1500 4.375 Semi Automatic from 8/68 – 8/70 with LSD
BE 1600 4.125 Semi Automatic from 8/70 – 8/71
BF 1600 4.125 Semi Automatic from 8/70 – 8/71 with LSD
BG 1600 4.125 Karmann Ghia Semi Automatic from 8/70
BH 1300 4.125 Karmann Ghia Semi Automatic from 8/70 with LSD
BJ 1300 4.375 Semi Automatic from 8/70
BK 1300 4.375 Semi Automatic from 8/70 with LSD
BL 1600 4.125 Semi Auto
BK 1300 4.375 Semi Automatic from 8/70 with LSD
DA 1500 /1600 4.125 Type 3 Swing-axle up to 8/68
DB 1500 /1600 4.125 Type 3 Swing-axle up to 8/68 with LSD
DC 1500 /1600 4.125 Type 3 IRS from 8/68
DD 1500 /1600 4.125 Type 3 IRS from 8/68 with IRS

To swap from swing axle to IRS you will need the following :-

Trailing arms IRS x 2 off a 1302/S 1303/S or Type 3 they are all the same
except the type 3 has bigger brakes which is good.

IRS spring plates x 2 (IRS ones are shorter)see above for donar

The inner coupling for the trailing arm. You can cut this out of the donar or buy them. They will need welding into the new frame. They need to go in the right place and angle.. see donar and take plenty of pictures / dimensions

New gearbox

Drive shafts

End caps (over spring plates)




Everything else is the same

...unless

You have a type 3 estate (variant) for a donar which has thicker tortion bars (28mm I think) Very adventagious to have these too. as they will help if you go off road and help on road with bigger hp.

:D

aplogise I did make it very clear.

If we stay with a swing axle i.e no welding ( he does not trust my handy work ! )
If they have a irs gearbox with both side plates is this more straight forward?

what else is required to be done and parts required ?


I beigining to think a trip to London breakers megabug might be easier to pick up a swing axle gearbox.

Caloun

Find yourself a swing axle gearbox unless you are going to change the suspension too. The diff will need gapping and the crown wheel is held on with big torque....loads of trouble and grief.

I have spoken to mega bug and they said 1600 sing axle gearboxs are rare. The only other alternative is to take a 1300 gearbox and change the crown and pinion.

Can anyone recommend a gearbox place to change the crown and pinion given the comments "loads of trouble and grief"

cheers

call Peter at Cog box on 020 8842 2580 - what he dont know about beetle gearboxes aint worth knowing - he is da man for drag race gear boxes - based in East london if I remember correctly - so not too far from you in Essex

cheers Knighty

Cal

Caloun, i got a 1300 swing axle box going cheap if that would make life easy for you. Just stripped it out of the bug (1970), let me know if that's any good to you.

Cheers
Ben.

ben

cheers for the offer but we ended up stripping a 1300 gearbox and fitting a higher ratio crown wheel (is that the right term?)

Cal

Cool glad you got it sorted B)